Enjoy our Event Circle Interview with author and change agent John Marshall Roberts -- fueled by his new book Igniting Inspiration: A Persuasion Manual for Visionaries.

"Seeking to improve the world is a futile game built upon a lie." (P. 63) How does this fit into the Green Movement, John?

When they seek to share their vision, most people who care about the world start from the assumption that something is wrong. This assumption always makes the other person (consciously or unconsciously) feel defensive and closed to what they are saying. Hence, no deep communication is possible, and nothing changes. Truly transformational communicators have a way of building trust with others by helping them feel that everything is fine, just as it is. And from this starting point, the other person is then willing to open up to an even more positive and inspiring vision of what could be.

The paradox beneath this whole conversation is that the best way to transform a situation (or a person, or a society) is to first love and accept it exactly as it is. Without acceptance as a starting point, we are trapped in our heads, fighting reality, throwing around impotent concepts based upon fear.

What would Dale Carnegie think of your ideas? Are you not supporting his call to ask: "How to make friends and influence people!?"

Dale Carnegie tapped into many of the same truths that I approach in my book. Unfortunately he didn't propose a scientifically grounded, explanatory framework to help people understand why his ideas worked sp well. Instead of telling people what to do -- giving them easy tips and feel -good aphorisms -- I wanted to help them understand so that they wouldn't need tips or gurus anymore. I believe understanding is the key to becoming a leader rather than a follower.

At the end of the day, inspirational communication is about leadership. We don't become leaders by following advice of any smart person or guru (myself included!). We become leaders by responding with courage and vision to the essence of every situation as it is. As leaders, will we end up winning friends and influencing people? Sure, most likely. But we're also likely to end up losing bad friends and upsetting people. It cuts both ways, and I don't want to coddle people into thinking otherwise.

People are strong. They don't need coddling. That's my starting point for dealing with everyone, for better or for worse.

I sit in a cube from 9 – 5. I'm bored. Why should I care about your ideas?

You should care because you are sitting in a cube from 9 to 5 bored. Is this what you hoped for when you were a child? Is this the highest vision that you hold for yourself? No, of course not.
There's nothing wrong with having a 9 to 5 job in a cubicle. The problem is boredom -- it's a sign that you are disconnected from the source that animates you. It's a sign that fear has become a shell keeping you from expressing your deeper passions.

Comfort is a trap sometimes. My deepest hope is that my ideas help wake people up from this slumber so that they realize what a tremendous gift it is to be alive, and that they express gratitude for this gift through all of their communications.

TV killing inspiration?

TV is definitely one hell of a brainwashing tool! But I wouldn't vilify it or blame it for the human condition. In fact, TV is just that -- a tool. Nothing more. Nothing less. I believe that TV (and movies, and the internet) will be wonderful tools for the evolution of the human species once we start using them for inspiring ends. The first step is that we take responsibility--individually and collectively-- for how we use these tools. What are we feeding our minds? More importantly, how are we using what we are feeding our minds? If it doesn't serve our happiness, what's the point? When will be willing to let ourselves be happy? Those are the questions.
For a person who is willing to enjoy life, TV can be a wonderfully inspiring invention. I love it. FOX TV can be particularly funny.

Can group-based (collective) inspiration help fuel a global revolution in consciousness? How?

I believe that collective inspiration is the ONLY way we will fuel a global revolution in consciousness. And it is happening right now, as we speak, around the globe. This conversation is part of that revolution, spread through the new global brain of the internet. How exciting is this?

In fact, if we look at the evolution of human thinking from 200,000 BC forward, we see that almost all major leaps forward in human thinking were the product of inspiration. The inspiration to band together in tribes, fashioning rits and rituals intended to gain favor with unseen gods (40,000 BC), the inspiration to reject rote tribal dogmas and create vast dictatorial regimes based upon the hero myth (8,000 BC), the inspiration to create the idea of 'right' and 'wrong' which propagate through huge organized religions (3,000 BC), the inspiration to reject religious dogma and to seek an understanding of the world through reason and the scientific method (after 1500 AD), the inspiration to let go of scientific materialism and connect more deeply with the human spirit (1900's AD), the inspiration to let go of the humanistic ideology and embrace life as a complex system in which all life is related, and in which we are an intricate part...

Inspiration is how human cultures evolve. The idea that revolutions can be forced through legislation or persuaded through sticks and carrots is extremely naive. Fear doesn't work. Only inspiration.

Do see any connection between the green movement, sustainability and mythology?

There is a tremendous correlation between these three movements. Mythologist Joseph Campbell believed that the infamous 'earthrise' satellite shot of earth from space from the late 60's was the beginning of a new modern mythology in which humans would finally start to see their selves as one, planetary species. This perspective would lead to a renewed interest in the environment and ecology, he thought.

And he was right.

Once people see how connected humans are to the earth, and to one another, a shift towards sustainable thinking is inevitable.

The sustainability has surely become the new mythology for our times. The challenge is that, as of now, about 90% of the human race is still fearfully clinging to old, outdated mythologies from a much simpler time.

Our main challenge today is to help these fellow humans feel safe enough to open up to a better, more inspiring way.

What are some of the common hesitations and concerns about your work in corporations? How do you get new clients?

I get new clients constantly through word of mouth. I do very little marketing -- except for speaking at conferences and writing the occasional article or blog. Word of mouth has been kind to me. The laws of inspiration, I guess?

As for my views on corporations -- I honestly find that they can be very stifling to the creative process and socially fear inducing to the point massive group lethargy. But that is all changing. Corporations are slowly but surely becoming a force for good. I'm doing what I can to help that process, that transformation, move forward.

I believe that one of the most dangerous things we can do is to fall into a 'corporations are evil' mindset. This sort of attitude shuts off the conversation, and leaves everyone cynical and mistrustful, gaming the system for their own survival. The biggest challenge of our time is for each of us to stop blaming each other for our problems. This just perpetuates the same rotten cycle that got us here.

It is unfortunate how, through corporations, so many of us have become unconscious. But it's also inspiring to think of what will be possible now that we've decided to turn the tide.

Cynicism towards change is a security blanket for those without the courage to be happy.

Is inspiration different for people vs. organizations?

I see everything through the lens of systems theory -- the whole world to me is a set of mutually dependent systems evolving towards complexity. People are systems. Organizations are systems. Economies are systems. Societies are systems.... etc.. But I believe that the leverage point for massive change rests within the individual. After all -- people created all of our social systems. People will also be the ones to fix them.
There are no 'masses' -- there are just people. 6.7 billion people, each acting in accordance with what they believe to be their own best interests.

Research suggests that, eventually, humans evolve to see that their own best interests are inextricably related to the best interests of everyone else on the planet. When this happens, they let go of fear and become powerful change agents.

The social systems on this planet will be easily changed when a critical number of people reach this point.

I believe we each vastly underestimate our power to change the world. I've decided to spend my careers helping people remember how much power they truly have when they act in accordance with their own deepest will.

Are you a Hero?

Wow, that's a loaded question! Um, I suppose so. Sure. Why not? I believe that anyone who has the courage to discover their own unique talents and use with an intention to be of service to others is a hero. We are all heroes...at various stages of unfolding.

Having said that, I'm excited to become a much better hero moving forward, like MLK, Jr. He's my hero. I'd love to be able to do what he did (but hopefully without the marital infidelities and assassination part).

"Coloring thinkers" into type yellow, blue, etc. What about Myers-Briggs, John?

Myers-Briggs is great. I spent many years studying the work of Carl Jung -- considered him a mentor throughout my 20's. So the meyer's briggs is wonderful.

The great thing about the research that I cover in my book (from developmental psychologist Clare W. Graves) is that I've found it to be more comprehensive and practical than even Carl Jung's work. In fact, the 'level of existence' framework that Graves developed helps us understand all of the other psychologies ever invented -- from Freud, to Adler, to Skinner, to Maslow, to Roger, to Jung. Graves's framework helps us understand the unique strengths and weaknesses of all of them. Shows us how they stack up, existentially and developmentally speaking. What I love about the Gravesian framework is it's practicality and inclusiveness.

How does Transformative Design relate to the personal re-programming at the Church of Scientology?

Doesn't relate at all, as far as I can tell. In fact, honestly the question kind of creeps me out!

Scientology is a very creative neo-freudian sci-fi religion. Transformational Design is a new communication framework for socially and environmentally conscious professionals -- not a religion or a cult. It's for everyday people who want to make a difference in the world by overcoming cynicism and inspiring positive behavior change. It's also for sustainable businesses who want to gain traction in the marketplace of ideas (and products).

LOHAS is just another BRAND. Right?

LOHAS is both a brand and a movement. In terms of Graves theories, the LOHAS segment refers largely to a subsegment of the the 'humanistic' (green, level 5) and 'systemi (yellow, level 6) thinking groups. These are people who are concerned with the state of the world, who want to live a healthy lifestyle, and who are often disenchanted with traditional capitalism. I wouldn't put too much stock in labels.

Where is the "source of life?" (p. 56)

Frankly, the source of life is a mystery. A complete and utter mystery that only a fool would try to explain or understand with his intellect. The source of life is that timeless essence beyond words, and beyond the constant ramblings of our everyday mind.